Podcasting for marginalized groups: Michelle Nogales of Bolivia’s Muy Waso

Audio is often described as the most intimate of mediums. The human voice is a powerful tool that is able to convey emotion and make connections in different ways than print can. Hearing someone tell their own story in their own words can be enormously compelling, capturing the authentic feelings that were felt right when the recording was made. Audio can provide an authentic snapshot of a specific moment.

For this and other reasons, podcasting is considered by many a powerful ally to minority and marginalized communities. Podcasts allow these groups, often overlooked by the larger society and the mainstream media, to speak up for themselves and give first-person accounts of their fears, hopes, successes and setbacks. It’s a kind of documentation that gives these groups, often ostracized or ignored, agency to shape their own narratives instead of having others form them or even misrepresent them.

This kind of representation is one of the main goals of Michelle Nogales and her organization Muy Waso. Founded in 218, it’s Bolivia’s first feminist digital media outlet. In a country dominated by a few traditional media outlets that have been reluctant to innovate, Muy Waso wanted to find new ways to communicate with audiences. They added to their text stories videos, memes, infographics and, yes, podcasts. The site also took a different approach to reporting in Bolivia, where conservative, patriarchal attitudes are strong. Muy Waso looks at the subjects it tackles – from culture to climate change – through a feminist lens.

Muy Waso is currently developing a limited podcast series on Bolivia’s LGBTQ+ community and the Catholic church. But it’s not the approach you might expect – that of two opposing polarities. Rather, the series will look at where these communities intersect. The series will aim to be a space where an overlooked minority inside a minority can tell their stories.

Michelle Nogales speaking to a group of media experts in Bonn

DW Akademie: Why do you think podcasting can be so relevant for communities that are marginalized or vulnerable?

Michelle Nogales: One reason is the really long tradition that Latin American groups have with radio and audio. In Bolivia, where I have the most experience, we have a tradition of miners’ radio. It dates from which mining was the main economic activity in the country. Most miners came from indigenous communities and as time passed, they began to be exploited by big companies and the government. So they began organizing, and much of that was done through the radio. So audio has had a huge, historically important impact on our lives. And it still reaches even the most remote communities here. Additionally, communities here have a tradition of gatherings and meetings where they decide on issues through discussion. Not to mention the fact that many indigenous groups don’t have writing systems for their languages. Their tradition is oral. Podcasting is just a small step from that tradition. 

Can you share with us an example of your podcasting working with marginalized groups that you found really compelling?

We told the story of one of Bolivia’s first Indigenous trans woman, Brígida Ajata. It was about how she managed to work through the conservative values that are very rooted in native, Indigenous communities. But at the same time, she talked about how other people were really open to her. We looked at her decision to keep the dress codes and cultural practices of her Indigenous group but also be accepted into the larger, more urban trans community.

What kind of impact did the podcast episode have?

Oh, it was the voice. Just listening to her talking, speaking in first person, and saying ‘This is my experience’, ‘This is how I lived’, connected so deeply with the audience. And that's why we just love podcasts for some stories and why we’re creating a new one on LGBTQ+ communities and religion.

How do you make sure that the groups and people you record are kind of represented authentically and with respect? I’m sure in many instances they’ve been stereotyped or misrepresented by the media.

We’re really careful with that because we don't like to make people look like they're victims. And it’s important to be sensitive with the person we’re talking to. Usually, we have a pre-interview with them, unrecorded, to get to know each other, find out if they are comfortable with certain topics and get their consent. That's a really feminist value, the idea of consent. You have to be aware that you are being like a confidante to them, the way you treat them, the way you ask questions, position the audio recorder or camera, all of that. You want to create a secure space where people will open up to you, but they feel you care about their perspective and aren’t just trying to get a story out of them and leave. If you earn their trust, you’re going to have a better, more authentic interview. And also something that can be useful for them, not only for you as a journalist.

Michelle Nogales Interviewing the leader of the Toba Qom Indigenous group

Do you feel that podcasts can serve as a historical record for some of these groups which are not very visible or often misrepresented?

Yes, absolutely. Because I think much of history is told by the winners, not by the side that lost. We have an official historical record that’s told on the biggest channels in the biggest spaces, like academic spaces. But there are often untold stories or stories which are not told enough. And I think those stories are really valuable. It's like the first-person experience, told from their perspective, from their feelings in their own bodies, from their own reality. In 20 years, we can look back and know how things evolved, how things really were if they changed or didn’t. Often history is written by outsiders who are interpreting events. But podcasting gives us a chance to exist through history in our own way, in our own language, in our own manner and not through someone who might come from the academic world, usually, who’s speaking for us.

If we're talking about historical records, I wonder if some kind of archive or repository of these audio documents is needed. They could easily get lost.

We really need to build this audio repository of the fights, struggles and needs of feminists, Indigenous, LGBTQ+ and other groups. And I think that that could be a really beautiful project because we don't have it here. I know of a repository of traditional songs from Bolivia that individuals are putting together. So I think we should follow their lead and actually build a new repository of audio history.

What impact do you hope that your work with these minority communities will have on them and also, but also on a broader audience in Bolivia?

For the people in our stories, I think it's really valuable for them. First, they feel like they are being listened to and that their experiences are important. I think it sparks something in them, a feeling that they can help their communities in certain situations. With a broader audience, I think that some people, such as those in the feminist or LGBTQ+ communities or people working on human rights, are aware of the issues we’re addressing. But we don't want to just talk to them, who are already our listeners. We want to talk to other people, like students, people in rural areas or everyday workers. Groups who don’t know about the issue we discuss. We want to explore the real diversity of the country. That’s valuable because the traditional media largely has a monopoly on information and people often believe the world as it is presented to them there. We want to give them more options.